Sharps and flats...?

[fancypiper]

When you play G and above, I drop the bottom hand ring finger back down. That also gives my fingers a "reference point" so my bottom fingers hit the holes I need later. When I play in AMix, (usual D fingering except the scale starts and ends on A) I usually use the middle finger to "balance" the whistle.

It took me a while to learn, but I would get relaxed and the tune would get to flowing and I would suddenly be playing "air whistle".

Some, maybe most folks use their bottom hand pinkie, but I have Dupetren's Contracture and never got the hang of that with my crooked pinkie.

I don't have trouble with the ghost D on the uilleann chanter, though, except for a little numbness where the scar for the operation I had on my right hand (my ring finger is more numb and I miss that hole sometimes, but I had a ridge installed on my C chanter so I can feel with the top side of my finger. The D set has larger holes and more "buzz" comes through them for feeling.

[MTGuru]

For cross fingering: Upper octave: XXO XOX

On my Sweetone/Meg, the G# fingering XXO XXO actually works better in the upper octave, and XXO XOX is too sharp. But my Susatos do prefer XXO XOX.

But it´s absolutely pointless to struggle with a D-instrument in C major or F major.

I agree ... mostly. But there are situations where playing in the cross-keys is useful. Somtimes, in a session or performance, there's simply no time to switch whistles when there's a key change. For example, in our local session repertoire, there are some tunes in G Dorian/Mixolydian, D Dorian, etc. The ability to keep going for at least one repetition before changing whistles can really help to preserve the continuity of the set.

It keeps you from dropping the whistle when using the top hand to play notes.

And here I was trying to figure out every sort of way to keep from dropping it. It's that simple.

Here I disagree strongly. Use your bottom pinky, not the other bottom fingers, to stabilize the whistle and keep from dropping it. Except for "lazy fingering", if you rely on closing bottom holes for stability, you are guaranteed to develop bad intonation habits.

Besides, for those G# cross-fingerings, those right hand fingers down are a necessary part of the fingering, not just for stability. And for the half-holed G#, bracing with the right hand shouldn't be strictly necessary.

Some folks use their bottom hand pinkie, but I have Dupetren's Contracture and never got the hang of that with my crooked pinkie.

Ah then, fair play to you. But it's hardly good advice to recommend your technique to a beginner who doesn't share your condition.

[fancypiper]

Here I disagree strongly. Use your bottom pinky, not the other bottom fingers, to stabilize the whistle and keep from dropping it. Except for "lazy fingering", if you rely on closing bottom holes for stability, you are guaranteed to develop bad intonation habits.

Not necessarily. I just "back off" or "lean into" the note and blow it into tune,

Besides, for those G# cross-fingerings, those right hand fingers down are a necessary part of the fingering, not just for stability. And for the half-holed G#, bracing with the right hand shouldn't be strictly necessary.

Yes, but If I don't have that "reference" position, I miss holes and then I have serious intonation problems (the scar on my ring finger is on both of the pads I need to play on whistles and pipes).

Also, the more "tricks" you can learn, the more flexibility you have as each whistle is a different beast. And when you have 22 of them lying around...

As always, YMMV.

[MTGuru]

To be kinder and gentler for a moment ...

I do think it's great how people compensate for their physical limitations or peculiarities to play. My own fingers are very curved in odd directions, requiring some positional adjustments on any instrument. One of my college roommates had a right hand consisting of an index finger and thumb, nothing more. And he was a fantastic electric bass player, both picked and fingerstyle. There's the classic case of Django Reinhardt. And Donncha Ó Briain, who played whistle with muscular dystrophy, as mentioned by Peter Laban here:

http://www.rogermillington.com/tunetoc/goldeneagle.html

[fancypiper]

Oops, was I being mean and nasty? If so, I didn't mean to, I was just passing along my experience as I was a beginner back in 1985. My general rule for playing is "whatever works" for you. I noticed some of the folks dropped out of the thread (or they are contemplating growing more fingers or cutting some of them off! ).

And Donncha Ó Briain played left handed and with curved fingers according to the picture on the vinyl record I have of him, IIRC (no guarantee on that). He was a kick a$$ whistler.

I met a whistler who was missing a finger from each hand and had to use her pinkie on both hands to play and she was fantastic!

[MTGuru]

Oops, was I being mean and nasty?

No no no, I meant me being mean and nasty! Or at least pedantic. So sorry, Phil.

I agree completely with "whatever works" too, once you're at the point where you know the difference. It's just that I've found in teaching beginning music and other things that there's a tendency to want to share the umpteen things you know, or the special tricks, which can sometimes be more confusing than helpful.

Besides, with those tiny furry paws of his, I'm not sure that hathair_bláth can even reach the bottom notes!

I noticed some of the folks dropped out of the thread (or they are contemplating growing more fingers or cutting some of them off!).

Yes, I've heard of "cuts" in Irish music. But a few extra digits would definitely be "handy".

[Brian Boru]

Regarding sharps and flats I have a question: Is it better to cross-finger or half-hole? Or is it like everything else in ITM in that there is no hard or fast rule.

[fancypiper]

Yes, I've heard of "cuts" in Irish music. But a few extra digits would definitely be "handy".

A third hand to play regulators would be even more "handy". Any volunteers for a doner for an extra right hand?

Argh! I just lost some good hints I had typed out, but I accedentally killed my browser and with my perfect memory (I forget everything!) I can't remember what I typed.

I think it was something like this:

Try a board search for "modes" for what "keys" a D whistle can play with C#/C natural, G/G# and F#/F.

Since I am string impaired, I play and think in notes (well, finger positions to be more precise) rather than chords (which quite a few musicians think in). You may get a guitar player that says something is in A minor (I grab a C whistle and find out it doesn't fit, it is in A Dorian instead and I need my D).

Basically, just mess around with the whistle(s) (you will eventually get WhOA) and see if it fits with the least "odd" notes.

You will learn to think of notes rather than key signatures, so first learn you and your whistle's C natural fingering, then the G# fingering, then the F natural fingering.

I would suggest learning the cross fingering of C natural first, then G# , then half holing those notes, then F natural (I only use half holing by straightning my middle finger and slightly lifting it off the far edge of the hole).

Changing from cross fingering to half holing makes nice variations, and the half holing allows you to "slide" into the note for a nice effect.

The first step, of course as Seamus Ennis says is "seven years of listening", so listen to as many whistle players as you can lay your hands on.

Whistling comes much easier (to me) using the ears rather than dots on a page. The dots are only the "bones" of the tune, listening will "flesh out" the tune, then you steal the players "licks" and eventually you will make that tune yours.

I can read music in 3 signatures, but it really slows me down!

Whistles rule! (but they are a gateway drug to much harder and more expensive drugs such as uilleann bagpipes and woodenflutes).

[fancypiper]

Regarding sharps and flats I have a question: Is it better to cross-finger or half-hole? Or is it like everything else in ITM in that there is no hard or fast rule.

It's better to use both!

There is only one hard and fast rule, IMHO, rhythm and lift is the most important part if ITM. It's dance music (or a tearjerking slow air which may be a sad song or have very rowdy words if you understand Gaelic, perfect for those slow slides into the half holing).

[Brian Boru]

Regarding sharps and flats I have a question: Is it better to cross-finger or half-hole? Or is it like everything else in ITM in that there is no hard or fast rule.

It's better to use both!

There is only one hard and fast rule, IMHO, rhythm and lift is the most important part if ITM. It's dance music (or a tearjerking slow air which may be a sad song or have very rowdy words if you understand Gaelic, perfect for those slow slides into the half holing).

My current challenge is the Mazurka on Altan's "First ten years". There is only one little section with flats so I don't think changing whistles would help but I can't do the half-holes up to speed

[fancypiper]

My current challenge is the Mazurka on Altan's "First ten years". There is only one little section with flats so I don't think changing whistles would help but I can't do the half-holes up to speed

It took me a few years to get any of my half holing up to speed.

I almost gave up trying, but suddenly they just jumped under my fingers.

What note is it and on which whistle?

Do you know the name of the mazurka? I don't have their "First ten years" CD, but I think I may have all their other CDs and I may be able to tell you "my way", but I only play about 5 mazurkas.

[falkbeer]

For cross fingering: Upper octave: XXO XOX

On my Sweetone/Meg, the G# fingering XXO XXO actually works better in the upper octave, and XXO XOX is too sharp. But my Susatos do prefer XXO XOX.

But it´s absolutely pointless to struggle with a D-instrument in C major or F major.

I agree ... mostly. But there are situations where playing in the cross-keys is useful. Somtimes, in a session or performance, there's simply no time to switch whistles when there's a key change. For example, in our local session repertoire, there are some tunes in G Dorian/Mixolydian, D Dorian, etc. The ability to keep going for at least one repetition before changing whistles can really help to preserve the continuity of the set.

I agree! It useful to at least get by in some related keyes! And in some cases a specially tuned whistle is to prefere. I have for example a whistle tuned in the dorean mode and several tuned in G minor: D,E,F#,G,A, Bb,C, (d). It´s very interesting to play such a whistle. You´ll get lots of new melodic ideas.

[MTGuru]

And in some cases a specially tuned whistle is to prefere. I have for example a whistle tuned in the dorean mode and several tuned in G minor: D,E,F#,G,A, Bb,C, (d). It´s very interesting to play such a whistle. You´ll get lots of new melodic ideas.

Ah, interesting. It would be easy to modify a D whistle for either of these with a bit of sticky tape to half-cover the E hole and/or A hole. I'll have to try that!

[MTGuru]

My current challenge is the Mazurka on Altan's "First ten years". There is only one little section with flats so I don't think changing whistles would help but I can't do the half-holes up to speed

Here's how I handle the altered notes in the Altan Mazurka (John Doherty's Mazurka).

http://www.thesession.org/tunes/display.php/2497

D# - Half-hole the side of the D hole with the tip of B3 finger (preferred). Or cover the top of the D hole with the pad of the B3 finger in the space between the D and E holes.

Bb - Half-hole the A hole by angling the end of the T2 finger up and away from the whistle, using the knuckle as a pivot point.

F natural - Half-hole the bottom of the E hole with the pad of the B2 finger in the space between the D and E holes (preferred). Or Catch the side of the E hole with the tip of the B2 finger.

For the A Major setting of the tune, my preferences for the alternate D# and F natural fingerings are reversed, and I also cross-finger all the G#s.

Hope that helps!

[falkbeer]

And in some cases a specially tuned whistle is to prefere. I have for example a whistle tuned in the dorean mode and several tuned in G minor: D,E,F#,G,A, Bb,C, (d). It´s very interesting to play such a whistle. You´ll get lots of new melodic ideas.

Ah, interesting. It would be easy to modify a D whistle for either of these with a bit of sticky tape to half-cover the E hole and/or A hole. I'll have to try that!

To make a D-dorean is actually quite simple. You take a C-whistle (try on a Generation first and not your expensive whistles) and cut a couple of cm so the bell note will become D. Then you have to drill a new top hole (the one close to the mouthpiece). At first when you try you´ll feel quite lost, but after a while the ideas will come flowing!!!

The g minor whistles i made by plugging the old holes and drilling new ones. A lot of work but it´s worth the trouble. G-minor is exeptionally well suited to swedish folk music i minor keyes.

Here is a short sample:

X:1
T:56. Glädjens blomster (Flowers of joy)
C:swedish trad
Q:"Andante"
L:1/8
M:3/4
K:Gmin

G>AB2G>B | A>^FD2F>G | A>BG4 :|
B>cd2B>d | d>dA2d2- | d2cB A>G | G2^F4 |
|:GA BA cB | AG BA G^F | ^F2G4 :|]


Good luck!