Need suggestions for flute to play at renaissance festival

[jemtheflute]

Having just acquired (for Xmas) and re-read John Solum's book The Early Flute I can say it has an excellent chapter on Renaissance flutes and their music/uses. Recommended.

I admit I haven't read all of this thread, just the last page or so (lack of time...... so forgive me if any re-treads or already excludeds), but seems to me an actual Renaissance flute (repro) would surely be The Thing. They're not necessarily horribly expensive - similar prices to keyless "Irish" flutes (e.g. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Professional- ... 1103023807 or http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Early-Baroque ... 1103279579) and are well suited to the music of the period (playing in C and F etc.) You might also consider Angus Fifes who offer flutes which have a very Renaissance look (though not necessarily performance) to them and will make just about anything in any material to order at pretty reasonable cost. Most of the specialist Period Instrument flute makers offer one or more versions of Renaissance flutes at various price levels and pitches, e.g. Boaz Berney. Go through The List for more - fun thing to do anyway.

And stop fussocking about wood - just take sensible precautions, not over fussy ones and it'll be fine!

[MTGuru]

I admit I haven't read all of this thread

Yes, that's obvious.

I think the problem is that the OP doesn't really want a Renaissance flute for the Renaissance Fair. As a silver Boehm flute player, she wants a keyed instrument that will give her a comparable range of keys and chromatics, but with a look that will pass muster as non-modern by the jumbled up aesthetic standards of a RenFair. So the goals are at cross purposes.

As for wood ... Sure, it won't melt in the rain, but you might not want to play it routinely in the rain or the freezing cold. And as cboody commented, looking after the needs of the musicians and their instruments is not always uppermost in organizers' minds. Like the museum benefit gala I once played where they put us and our $30K of instruments and gear outdoors on the museum steps - in a rainstorm. When we objected, they seemed nonplussed ("What, is that a problem?").

[jemtheflute]

Sounds like (a) rather duff event(s)!

I did read the OP's bit (I think?) about preferring cross-fingering to half-holing, and TBH I think a switch (for a Böhm player) to an instrument offering that (as a Ren Flute does) needs about the same level of transition work/familiarisation as would a 4-key simple system and in some respects would be more sensible as well as more "authentic" (FWTW) and potentially cheaper.

[Jayhawk]

Jem....I think you may have missed all the key middle bits to this thread. Temps from mid to low 30s in the mornings, some days with highs above 100, crowds between 10,000 to 20,000 each weekend. You really need durability and volume. Wood can be fine, but do renaissance flutes have the volume?

Eric

[jemtheflute]

Probably not enough volume (though playing context kinda makes a difference - amplified on a stage, acoustic in a stall in a "craft village", busking under a tree.....???) but then, neither will a single metal Böhm flute outdoors. The old "can't hear it close up/in the ensemble but can hear the flute and only the flute a field away" phenomenon will operate. And I still don't see the issue over wood - I'd be playing my R&R if I had a gig to play the music I play in a similar environment, with appropriate precautions.

[Jayhawk]

Jem - I played in the rain when it was about 42 degrees for over two hours...you may want to take your R&R out in that, but I chose to keep my antique cocus flute at home, dry. Considering how poor attendace was, we pulled in a ton of tips that day...pity 20 dollar tips really add up!

The renfest is unamplified, outdoors.

All that said, I would take a wooden instrument out there (I do on nicer days).

Eric

[insidiousraven]

Luckily, our group has a giant umbrella for musicians to stand under if the weather gets too nasty.

[jemtheflute]

I played in the rain when it was about 42 degrees

Fahrenheit or Celsius? I've kinda forgotten how to think in °F. If °F, chilly-horrid (c 5°C)! I pity your fingers! If °C, very uncomfortably hot! I have to admit I just would NOT play actually directly exposed to the rain in such circs. Nor in direct sun for long if temperature much above c25°C. If on a parade, maybe, but not otherwise. My Ebonite RC picc got a bit greenified in the drizzle on the parade in Lorient in Aug 08! There'd have to be some sort of overhead shelter or forget it, and not just because of the instruments. But then, in GB most events either cancel/postpone for bad weather or have at least partial alternative arrangements in place, given our "climate". And no guitarist, fiddler or squeeze box player is going to agree to play in the rain unsheltered anyway! Their instruments are a darn sight more susceptible to water damage! Fife and drum can cope, I daresay, though maybe drum skins not too happy..... I just can't see this as a specifically flute problem or a particularly bad one for flute compared to other instruments. Even a modern metal piccolo or a fife won't work too well on a really windy day.

And........ IMO, either you go for some decent approximation of "authenticity" and provide what you provide and if it can't be heard or you have to run for cover in wet or extreme heat, tough; or you go for durability and play genuine Renaissance music unashamedly on modern instruments (especially if that is really all you play) and make no bones about what you're doing - either they book/admit you or they don't.

A few years back when I was in a band which did a bit of busking and other outdoor stuff, we bought our own cheap gazebo for shelter purposes.

[Jayhawk]

Farenheit...it was miserable and our location had no overhead cover other than a few trees. Me and our drummer/whistle player (he played whistle) were the only two playing...the fiddler, guitar players and our bass player all sat inside a drink stand to try and stay dry.

At least it was warm enough it wasn't sleet...I've been out there when it sleeted most of the day, and that was beyond bad...but essentially no guests were there so we just sat inside stores and were generally colder than we'd like to be.

American Renaissance festivals tread heaving on the fantasy/historical line. We have fairies, a mermaid, and some hard core historical folks all mixed together...and for some bizarre reason one of our weekends is a combined Irish/Steampunk theme. People play instruments that range from purely modern to hurdy gurdies, but most are not truly period/authentic in any way shape or form.

I think the original poster's idea to go with a Sweetheart 4 key is a good compromise. Ralph makes very hearty flutes that withstand the elements well, he has nice rosewood, and 4 keys are rather unobtrusive.

Eric

[cboody]

A page linked at the bottom of Rick Wilson's page on flutes in the Renaissance:

http://www.flutehistory.com/Instrument/Renaissance.php3

And another, from a perfunctory Google:

http://www.music.iastate.edu/antiqua/tr_flute.htm

I dunno. My impression is that they were used pretty extensively in the Renaissance. They were clearly one of the main instruments, including for orchestral work, in the Baroque - read Quantz - and then went from strength to strength in the 19c, as improvements were made to enable the flute to keep up with contemporary technical improvements in other instruments.

There's that one comment, on the second page linked to above, about flutes falling in popularity towards the end of the 17c. This fall in popularity can't have lasted long, judging by the Quantz book, written in 1752. From memory, he switched to flute from violin when he was about 20 (so 1717) because it gave him increased opportunities for work and fame. (Again, just an impression from reading the book - it's not a quote.)

There's not a lot about outside playing of flutes, but there are comments here and there, on that Rick Wilson page and on the other that he links to, which suggests that it may have been military use that caused the spread in popularity of the flute. I'd be interested if there's anything else out there, about any style of flute playing in the Renaissance, indoor or outdoor.

The link to military flutes on the first URL above is interesting, and not something I was well aware of. However, the implication by the end of the page was that the instrument in question was what we now call a fife. That is more like a piccolo in sound than our current flute. Doubtless the fife has a long and distinguished military career. So, the disagreement in the discussion might be due to different definitions of "flute." Once again the etching is from the same collection which, to my knowledge, is not very accurate as to actual situations of use. Clearly that UrL also implies the common use is in consorts of soft instruments...i.e. inside playing. The rise of interest in the flute in the Baroque was due to the feeling during that era that the voice was the most perfect instrument and so it followed that the instrument that could do the most vocal things, the flute in their estimation, would be the instrument closest to the voice in capability. The flute became a part of the orchestral family and developed volume (and keys) in response to the needs of the particular time and place. It is important to remember that early orchestral concerts were really rather small affairs and the halls were much smaller. As the spaces grew all of the instruments changed in response to the need to fill the larger spaces.

In re keys on the instrument Quantz is supposed to have once lamented that he didn't have both a D# and an Eb key, and also commented that if he had those it would be sufficient. I can't dig up that reference though, so maybe it is just my mind babbling The is a quote often used to explain the preference for various "non-equal tempered" tunings in the era.

However, we've highjacked the original poster's topic. So, I'll stop here. If someone wants to extend this start a new topic and we can continue things.

[Tunborough]

According to Timothy McGee in Medieval and Renaissance Music: A Performer's Guide, the transverse flute was virtually absent in the 15th century. In the Middle Ages, it was used with the tabor, with military connections, in Germany and Switzerland. In the late 15th century, it showed up in art music, with "soft" instruments.

For historical accuracy, and to really get your audience's attention, what you need is a shawm: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=92292.