Yet another Rudall for sale on eBay!

[RudallRose]

Yes. It's all about the snoot!

[Jon C.]

In the meantime, how's my anonymous 8-key coming?

I still have that William Camp boxwood F to bring in, plus a variety of small jobs (tenon re-corking, etc.).

Busted... I will get right on it... [/quote]

Just because it doesn't have a snooty Rudall name.

It's a fine flute, good solid key work, plays great, almost finished! The best thing of all, is the beautifully figured Cocuswood!

[Jon C.]

I will let you guys know in a couple of weeks, when I take it for a spin...

.... it will be in my shop next week! The smoking pipes gave him away...
Should be playing in a jiffy, repair a couple cracks, slap on some new pads, and away we go!
It is interesting that they were using nice Cocuswood in the later flutes, seems like there was a lot of cracking ebony in the mid century... I guess they got the good stuff for the RC Bohm flutes? It would be interesting to get the history of the Cocus supply, and other woods, tied to the slave trade? Seems like there were batches of Madgascar ebony passed off as Cocus quite a bit... (the other brown wood)?

indeed!

So we'll be able to find out how all our measurement-based surmises and deductions about pitch/scaling relate to reality!

I agree, it would be fascinating to have a history of the cocus trade. I'm not sure how relevant the slave trade was, though - abolished in GB in 1807 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slave_Trade_Act_1807), remember, though that's not to say British-owned ships weren't illicitly involved in the US slave trade and the classic GB-Africa-Caribbean/mainland Americas triangle at later dates. Sugar and rum imports to GB were probably more significant parallel trades, though. Certainly very high quality cocus of the red, veiny-grained/"figured" variety (rather than the duller red-brown earlier stuff - or was that acid-stained and they gave up on that later?) seems to have been plentiful enough for the London and French makers, including in unflawed pieces long enough for "unibody" Bohm flutes!

(Oooh, quick bit of surfing found this - a piccy!!: http://toptropicals.com/catalog/uid/brya_ebenus.htm. You'll have to try growing your own, Jon - you probably have a suitable climate!)

It would have been a return trip, after dropping off the slaves, load up on logs for the return trip... I have seen a lot more American flutes made from the nice red Cocuswood, then the ebony look alike, but they were a lot closer to Cuba then Africa... The dull red black wood, I believe is. Brown ebony, maybe Madagascar grown? They were probably passing it off as "Coco wood", I mean, it is brown wood... I have read some old text on the subject of good versus bad Cocuswood, but nothing is compiled.

[Jon C.]

It would have been a return trip, after dropping off the slaves, load up on logs for the return trip... I have seen a lot more American flutes made from the nice red Cocuswood, then the ebony look alike, but they were a lot closer to Cuba then Africa... The dull red black wood, I believe is. Brown ebony, maybe Madagascar grown? They were probably passing it off as "Coco wood", I mean, it is brown wood... I have read some old text on the subject of good versus bad Cocuswood, but nothing is compiled.

I found it! http://www.thebagpipeplace.com/school/p ... tmlthetext is from1920, but explains about the wood used for Pipes?

[kkrell]

Corrected Link:

http://www.thebagpipeplace.com/school/page10.html

[Jon C.]

Thanks, I am on a iPad, marginal at best...
So I found out where they got the imitation Cocuswood, it was called Kok-ra wood from India!
Said it was much used for the manufacture of flutes!
http://books.google.com/books?id=iJpAAA ... of&f=false
Latin name: Lepidostachys Roxburghii
Now I have a name for this imposter wood, that cracks at the least provocation...
An entry from another book is quite revealing:
http://books.google.com/books?id=kfgYAA ... ry&f=false

...should be ascertained if it is of equal quality as the East Indies variety... They thought it was the same tree. Little did they know, that it had poor quality for flutes! This makes sense, with England's involvement with India. What do you think, Jem?

[Jon C.]

Got the flute in for restoration, and it is already finished!
The flute plays great! No tuning issues, plays at 440htz with the slide pulled out 17mm.
the foot pads are the Bohm type, so I have to get some of those.
The wood is beautiful Cuban Cocus, very red. It looks like the flute was only played a couple of times, I love this kind of restoration...




I could just imagine, the order coming in for one of those old conical flutes, the senior flute maker says, "sure I can still make one of those..."

[Jon C.]

Her is the flute in the Rudall Carte catalog, good price!
http://www.oldflutes.com/catalogs/RC/rc8.html

[RudallRose]

not exactly, Jon
the flute you worked on has a two-piece headjoint
the advertisement talks of the parabolic headjoint which even the drawing shows was one-piece and likely used the french slide.

still...it does show the modern foot was avail on the conoidal flute.

[Jon C.]

not exactly, Jon
the flute you worked on has a two-piece headjoint
the advertisement talks of the parabolic headjoint which even the drawing shows was one-piece and likely used the french slide.

still...it does show the modern foot was avail on the conoidal flute.

There is a choice of conical or cylindrical with a parabolic head. The former would probably have a conventional slide, since the one I restored has this...

[RudallRose]

The former would probably have ...

Very dangerous assumption when dealing with historical research.
Bad to presume.
The ad says what it says. We shouldn't presume what was lest we know for sure.
Otherwise we get to revise history....and I won't even get into that one!

[dunnp]

What is better evidence a flute in hand or an ad? Also why would a conical flute need a parabolic head?
The flute in the drawing is something like calum stewart's with one piece head and no split in the middle ( i think).

[Jon C.]

What is better evidence a flute in hand or an ad? Also why would a conical flute need a parabolic head?
The flute in the drawing is something like calum stewart's with one piece head and no split in the middle ( i think).

The ad states that it is available with a conical bore, and the flute was made in the early 20th century by this company, so it is a fact, not a dangerous assumption...
I have to now figure out,the. Bohm keys on the foot, they use those new fangled Bohm style pads, little donuts...

[dunnp]

My comment was directed at david. I agree the flute you had is what is listed there as the conical bore model. What better evidence than the flute. The ad should maybe read: conical bore, or cylindrical bore with parabolic head.
Not conical or cylindrical with parabolic head.
Hence my question to david why would a conical flute have a parabolic head.
I would assume the conical bore would have a two piece normal head.
If david is right we would need to find conical bore with french slide, at least thats how i,m reading his argument. So easy to misread however as you mistook me for disagreeing with you.
Clearly the flute in hand is better evidence for our assumption.

[RudallRose]

the flute in hand merely proves that particular flute was made with the two-piece head (again, we presume....there are no matching serial numbers to the head and body on Rudalls...that was a feature started by Siccama and followed wisely by Hudson-then-Boosey on the Prattens).
The ad is very clearly not noting this option.
The danger is in presuming ALL those flutes came that way in that late a period. There are several conoidal flutes made with the french/parabolic head.

it's possible it was indeed that way.....but lest we see them all that way (and the catalogue does not show this) or we see the ad specifically saying it, the presumption is just that .... a guess.