Ebonite(hard rubber) for flutes

[yooval]

Does anyone have experience with instruments made of Ebonite (hard rubber)? what do you think of it compared to the more common Blackwood?

here is also an interesting link:
http://www.ridenourclarinetproducts.com ... lamyth.htm

[AaronMalcomb]

Turlach Boylan plays an ebonite flute (sample on Wooden Flute Obsession 1).

They obviously sound comparable to blackwood flutes. With age there is some greenish-brown discoloration and the material becomes brittle and not easily reparable if damaged.

As for your link, the differences in sound from one material to the next is highly subjective. We've gone around in circles on this forum on the very topic. The debate was really explored in this thread which featured a blind test. The answers are here.

[david quinn]

I have several flutes made from ebonite(vulcanized rubber) they are far more powerfull than their wooden counterparts. The tones holes and the bore as well as embouchere will always stay the same size unlike wood. As said it becomes more green after age but this can be reduced by using handcream to keep the original colour.

[jim stone]

I played an ebonite F flute owned by ralph sweet.
It sounded very good.

[Jayhawk]

There's nothing wrong with Turloch's flute - that's for sure! Terry McGee I believe has repaired ebonite before on antique flutes...so they can be fixed if need be.

Eric

[yooval]

is bakelite same as ebonite?

[hans]

is bakelite same as ebonite?

"Bakelite (Pronounced bakerlight) is the trade name for the first commercially successful, thermo set plastic. It was patented on the 14th of June 1907 in Ghent in Belgium by Leo Baekeland and named after him. It is a polymer of phenol and formaldehyde with a filler, usually of sawdust. It was used in the manufacture of many telephone cases and internal parts.
Baekeland then emigrated to America to develop his invention there.
By an extraordinary co-incidence, James Swinburne, a Scottish engineer, applied for a similar patent the following day.
Baekeland and Swinburne swiftly buried their differences, opening factories in The USA and England. Swinburne's Damard Lacquer Company was eventually renamed Bakelite Ltd in 1927 with Swinburne as its chairman.
It seems a strange twist of fate, that the future of Bakelite, a substance fundamental to many telephones, should be decided by patent applications placed one day apart. It echoes the original patent applications for the telephone placed by Bell and Gray on the same day*.
bullet

Ebonite is a vulcanised hard rubber compound predating bakelite. It was used as an insulator or an insulating covering for early telephone parts.
It is most commonly seen as the covering on Bell receivers (the receiver seen on candlestick telephones). It is naturally deep black in colour and can be polished to a high standard. The surface readily degrades on contact with the atmosphere, and the action of light, to a brown semi-matt finish. "
http://www.theoldtelephone.co.uk/FAQ2/Bakelite_etc.htm

[cajordan]

I have several flutes made from ebonite(vulcanized rubber) they are far more powerfull than their wooden counterparts. The tones holes and the bore as well as embouchere will always stay the same size unlike wood. As said it becomes more green after age but this can be reduced by using handcream to keep the original colour.

Thanks, I must try that .. i have a flute with an ebonite head thats definately a greenish colour.

(I haven't the experience to say reliable things about how it sounds... but it's definately a sharper/brighter toned flute than my yew wood Bleazey ... that could be for all sorts of reasons though, such as the ebonite head is fully lined and the body is (probably) rosewood, and almost anything is
brighter than the yew!)

Chris

[jemtheflute]

I believe ebonite is still very commonly used for oboes and clarinets, especially at the "student" end of the market - and that the modern version of the material doesn't have the same problems of greening/yellowing with exposure to light, nor the tendency of some antique C19th ebonite to craze and potentially shatter. Apparently this is down to a better understanding and control of the chemistry (I'm no chemist, so don't assume I've got this right, just relaying something I remember being told either by Paul Davis or Jeremy Montague) - it has something to do with the presence of or amount of sulphur in the vulcanised rubber mixture - too much leads to the degradation.

Of course, the Great and Influential R.S. Rockstro was a proponent of ebonite - thought it was the best thing since...... Seriously, he may be a controversial commentator, but he really was chiefly interested in optimising the flute and his comments are worth noting, even if not always agreed with.

As for actual instruments, I have myself a nice Rudall Carte ebonite 6-key simple system piccolo, probably early C20th, which is almost new looking shiny black and plays very clearly and sweetly. I also recently passed on to a student a (probably) C20th German made ebonite 8-key flute which plays rather well, though it is a bit of a lump of a thing.... ideal for a beginner!

Partial digression (it IS actually made of modern ebonite......) - a while back (sort of unintentionally) acquired what I assume to be one of those "Empire" or similar Indian or Pakistani 8-key things, which actually isn't as bad as all that! It plays quite tolerably in Eb, though I'd wager it is actually modelled on a High Pitch D instrument. The tone is quite decent and the intonation pretty acceptable, thought the embouchure is rather crudely cut - assymetric undercut and generally poorly finished (that reminds me, I keep meaning to have a go at it....). Its worst deficiency is the bad design of the Boehm style foot keys - they work OK, as do the others, despite being cheap and cheerful, but are just made wrong, projecting too far up the flute and getting in the way of RH3 - you either turn 'em away and get a low "D" but no use of the foot keys, or try to use 'em and either miss the E tone hole with RH3 or catch the Eb key whilst trying to do so! You know, I reckon if someone got hold of those manufacturers, got them to use a modern D pitch model, sort out the foot key design and have some quality control on the embouchure finishing, they would make quite acceptable student flutes!!!!!!!! They really aren't THAT far off. (Is this a heresy?)

Happy tootling!
Jem.