I don't like fast Irish tradition music. Give me my airs.

[CelticWhistler]

Trampling on something else doesn't make you or your preference any bigger.

I didn't realize I was 'trampling'. It seems you take a lot of what I say personally. Just to make things a bit clearer, I have nothing against people who enjoy playing or listening to fast IT music, and I am certainly not telling people what they should or shouldn't do. I think people should play whatever they enjoy, regardless of what other people think. I was just stating my personal preference, and my inability to understand the never-ending 'need for speed' quest required to play IT dance music. But absolutely there is room enough in the world for all types of music, even.. *ahem* opera.

[tompipes]

There's some beautiful slower tunes on this CD.
http://homepage.eircom.net/~caoimhin/seolanews.htm

One of my favourite CD's anyway.

Tommy

[CelticWhistler]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFjH4ZqwOB4

Lmao.

[CelticWhistler]

I must agree with the OP in that I am extremely put off by recordings of the dance music in which the player's tempo exceeds the threshold beyond which they are able to play expressively. I want the dance music to lilt and make me want to dance, not attack me with an endless barrage of notes.

So I play my tunes rather slowly, because that's how I sound best.

I totally agree. Expressiveness and style does seem to get lost as the songs get faster and faster. I actually like some moderate speed Irish dance tunes. But it seems from my observations, to many that lightning speed is the top priority.

And regarding IT dance music in general, I read somewhere that certain players think that many do play Irish jigs and reels at too fast a tempo, because they were originally meant to be danced to. But these days it appears that most audiences just sit and listen in the pubs or outdoor sessions instead of dancing, so perhaps extreme tempos are not an issue. I suppose all-out speed can sound impressive and skillful. Maybe my brain is just slow.

[AlBrown]

I would respectfully suggest that there is no such thing as a "Celtic" air. You have Irish airs and Scottish airs, and laments and lullabies, and all sorts of specific slow tunes, but that "Celtic" label misses some very important distinctions. I use the "Celtic" term myself, but approaching a tune, slow or fast, in a generalized fashion, not shaped by the particular tradition it belongs in, can lead people astray...
Regarding the original statement, I think that if you reject a whole class of tunes, you are missing a lot. You don't have to play the dance tunes at lightning speed, there are just as many relaxed ceilidhe dancers in the world as there are fast paced set dancers. Keep you mind open...

[CelticWhistler]

I would respectfully suggest that there is no such thing as a "Celtic" air. You have Irish airs and Scottish airs, and laments and lullabies, and all sorts of specific slow tunes, but that "Celtic" label misses some very important distinctions. I use the "Celtic" term myself, but approaching a tune, slow or fast, in a generalized fashion, not shaped by the particular tradition it belongs in, can lead people astray...
Regarding the original statement, I think that if you reject a whole class of tunes, you are missing a lot. You don't have to play the dance tunes at lightning speed, there are just as many relaxed ceilidhe dancers in the world as there are fast paced set dancers. Keep you mind open...

Yes, I know I was generalizing with the term 'Celtic air', and I do know there are differences between Scottish and Irish lullabies, ballads, waltzes, and airs.

I'm not rejecting anything. As I said earlier, I do like some moderately fast IT dance tunes. I just don't like most fast music in general, regardless of the genre. I am still a bit puzzled as to why slower airs, ballads, waltzes, etc are so unpopular compared to fast jigs and reels. Maybe it has to do with the whole ITM session thing.

[wizzywig]

Well CW, you have certainly made an impact!

[Mr.Gumby]

I didn't realize I was 'trampling'.

Ignorance is bliss. That was the point I was making, your posts reeked of ignorance. Cultural sensitivities aren't your strong point.

I know I was generalizing with the term 'Celtic air

You can say that again. I mean, you just recommended 'The sash me father wore' as one of your favourite 'celtic airs' (on the IrTrad forum). See how that opens you up to a few misunderstandings.




Take care.

[talasiga]

Okay, I admit it. As a whistle player (and soon-to-be flute player), I don't like fast Irish tradition music (reels, jigs, etc). No offense to anyone here, and I am not knocking this style. But for me personally, it just doesn't work. I have played the whistle for more than 5 years now, and started out playing fast ITM, but I don't play this style any more. Modern society is already rush-rush enough as it is.

I personally love playing Gaelic airs and ballads on my low whistles, especially with guitar or harp accompaniment. Maybe this style reflects my character- easygoing and meditative. Slow, sad airs with deep feeling really do it for me. Very relaxing and emotional. I just don't get this whole 'speed thing', especially among whistle players. Like it's race or something to see who can flick their fingers the fastest, often sloppily. It's like driving a car at high speed through the countryside on a Sunday afternoon... driving so fast that one is unable to enjoy the beautiful countryside as it whizzes by outside the window. I do realize that fast dance music is the majority of ITM repertoire, but I guess it's just not for me. Give me my airs and ballads any day. I noticed that there are rarely any threads about Gaelic airs or ballads in these forums. Seems I may be in the minority.

Again, no offense to anyone here who enjoys playing fast ITM.

My love of Celtic traditions was born in the early 1970's, born of slow airs.

Alan Stivell with his Breton Harp singing solo, Scottish bagpipes and my ex wife singing slow airs and ballads of Britain and Ireland. One can drink deeply of the ethos, the flavour, the rasa (as we call it in our indic tradition/s) of the culture's music by listening to such airs played expressively and well. The nourishment from such experience can become something that informs our developing appreciation of the faster dance music and, in time, we may discern the two poles of the tradition as the ebb and flow of the same stream under different weather conditions.

[talasiga]

Therefore, despite what some may view as a clumsy or bluntly expressed operating post (OP) I wish this topic well.

Taken in a constructive spirit the topic may be an opportunity to explore the complementary relationship between slow airs and dance tunes in the different and distinctive traditions of Ireland, Scotland, Brittany etc which we can correctly label generically as "Celtic".

I see no great harm in the OP being a "confession" of where CW is in his or her appreciation of a tradition at this point in time.

I mean, come on folks, a post isn't etched in Sinai stone as a poster's absolute illumination till doomsday.

[benhall.1]

I completely agree with everything Mr Gumby has said in this thread. Just a few other points, in no particular order:

I'm guessing the poster of the OP is not actually "Celtic", because no-one who is would describe themselves thus. In fact, I tend to think that people who use that term don't really understand Irish, Scottish, Breton or Welsh (Manx and one or two others as well ...) music. It's generally borne out ...

No, I don't think it's a tough crowd here. Considering the nature of the OP, I think you've got off lightly so far.

Did (s)he really recommend "The Sash me Father Wore"??!?!!

I do think, in order to be able to play slow airs properly, it is necessary to know the songs (unless it's a composed air which has never had any words - few and far between if we're talking trad - non-existent, maybe?). I have heard people attempt slow airs and completely trample on the phrasing because they didn't know where the words go and where the natural end to verbal phrases was. I had to stop someone in a session who did that. Musically, it sounded OK, but it did my head in what was happening with the phrasing, so it had to stop. I stopped it. Someone else told them not to play for the rest of the evening (which I think was fair, but harsher than I was prepared to go). Also, if you did know the songs, you might think twice about playing TSMFW, or other overtly sectarian airs from either (any?) side. On the other hand, if you actively support one side, then play on ... just watch the company you play it in.

Oh, and, @ Ian Parfitt, please please please let's spell "air" correctly and not get all Spenserian and dewy eyed about it.

[Mr.Gumby]

Did (s)he really recommend "The Sash me Father Wore"??!?!!

Yes but the post was deleted just now.

[benhall.1]

Ah right ... I think my point about it still stands though. If you knew the words, then play it out of choice if that's where you stand. Just don't stand near me.

[Not you, of course, Mr Gumby - you'd be very welcome over here in the grumpy corner.]

[Makar]

I'm not sure if this is the right post to try this stuff out in but thought I 'd give it a try...

[Mr.Gumby]

either that or someone who really doesn't get it and just keeps on digging a deeper and deeper hole.