Hi Will,
I'll add one more post and try to explain what the problem I have is. Basically, I don't feel that people are
able to have a discussion with you. You make declarative statements with no room for the possibility that you may be wrong and then when people tell you that they think you are wrong, you tell them that your greater experience is why you are right and that once they have as much experience as you they will agree with you.
The problem with this approach is that 1) It's circular argument: "I am right, if you don't agree with me, it's because you don't know as much as me, so I am right", 2) You don't anyone else's experience, and hence you are pre-judging everyone: "You disagree with me, so you must know less then me", and 3) Your years at it don't necessarily mean anything. As I've said before, I've met plenty of people with your experience (years, instruments and people) who don't understand irish music and don't have much knowledge of it.
So until you resolve these issues, we aren't going to be able to actually
discuss anything. All that will happen is that you will make statements that other people view as wrong and they will tell you why they think you are wrong, and then you will use your trump card of "experience" and declare yourself to be correct.
However, I will in fact try to discuss these things with you, so feel free to prove that you are in fact willing to have a discussion!
fiddlerwill wrote:Nico, Im not trying to pull some 'trump ' card. Simply stating facts in
You posted in this thread your experience immediately after being disagreed with, in a manner that was intended to demonstrate that you and only you could be correct due to your experience. This is what I (and I assume most people) refer to as "a trump" or "trumping". You may not have intended it in that manner. If that's the case, then you should be aware that it is how it came across, and you should be more careful in the future.
fiddlerwill wrote:as a piper you should surely understand that the drones dont 'make the notes appear 'in a gapped scale. They provide those tones.
I am confused. You are saying the drones don't provide the notes, and then they do. Which is it? Either way, my opinion is that they don't provide the notes in a gapped scale (unless the missing note is a D!) Just to clarify, the uilleann pipes have three drones, all playing a D, each an octave apart. Please explain how this provides the missing notes in a gapped scale.
fiddlerwill wrote: As regarding the melody, Yes on its own its all that is needed, but to make the mistake to think that that is all there is? When its absolutely clear that there is much more than just the melody within the tradition.
We agree then. The melody on its own is all that is needed. Great! I'm glad you've come around to our point of view. As for the rest, the melody is all there is when a tune is played on a whistle or flute. The melody is all there is when it's played on the uilleann pipe chanter alone. The melody is all there is when it's played on the fiddle without any doubling extra strings being played. However a lot of a great fiddlers, pipers, box players, and concertina players will play additional notes, harmonies or even chords if you will. This is exactly why I said, and maintain, that being a guitar player is not required to understand these things. These players understand the modes and the chords required quite well. It does add something, more than a loud guitar playing full chords, in my opinion (which I acknowledge is not shared by everyone in the irish traditional music community).
fiddlerwill wrote:Anyhow. I don't know you nico, you don't know me, so perhaps your assumptions might be re-thought in that light
Will, please reread this sentence and think about how it applies to yourself. You don't know me, either. Either way, I do actually know a few things about you, from your many posts on here and thesession.org. Knowing more isn't really important, or even necessarily useful. Take the statements at face value and try to understand that you may not be right. That's what I do.
fiddlerwill wrote:So nico, you accuse me of inaccurate arrogant statements. , in your opinion. in fact? no, if so prove it.
I believe I have, a couple times. Your comment about the drones for instance. Your comments about keys and modes have also been proven wrong. You just don't accept that you are wrong.
fiddlerwill wrote:I am not arrogant. I simply know my subject.
I think you should perhaps educate yourself on the definition of arrogant. I too "know my subject" as I've studied this music for quite some time. Yet I don't make the mistake of assuming I am correct all the time and that I know all there is to know about it.
fiddlerwill wrote:Otherwise why should I take you seriously?
This is the nature of a message board. You judge the content of a post by its content. You don't need to know any more about me, you don't need to know who I have played with or where or for how long. Just like I do not need to know this about you. It is essentially irrelevant to discussions about the structure of the music. Furthermore it is fairly arrogant to provide all of these things, and then assume you are the most knowledgeable because of it. You don't know which of us is actually Mick O'Brien in disguise. So, no, I won't bother trying to "justify" myself by relating my experiences, because unlike you, I know it is irrelevant.
fiddlerwill wrote:You may well be a competent even good, brilliant piper, But does that qualify you to lecture me on chord patterns modes ? No it doesnt.
If I were a brilliant piper, why wouldn't it qualify me to discuss chords and modes? Please explain. My opinion is that a brilliant fiddler or piper would be very well qualified to discuss chords and modes, having no doubt played, listened to, studied and thought about chords and modes to a very large degree.
But why do you care if I try to justify myself at all? You have basically just said "prove yourself, but it doesn't matter if you do, you still aren't as experienced as me".
fiddlerwill wrote:As far as gaining respect! from a few online posers or middle of the road fiddlers!?! do you really think I care an ounce for your respect! No
Why are you online at all then? What is the point? If you care so little about anyone here, why even bother to post at all? There is no point in posting online if you have no respect for the people you are communicating with, unless your only reason is to be a troll.
Anyway, I'm done feeding, sorry to everyone that I contributed to this nonsense!
.
