A good next key for a whistle?

[Fifthtry]

I'm a newbie who only has a high D whistle, and I only play Irish Traditional Music (so far). So, I'm in the early stages of what appears to be (based on this board) an addiction that only gets worse. Fine.

What would be a good next key whistle to get? For example, I could get a C, which would let me play the D dorian and A minor tunes. I could get a G. I can play G on my high D whistle, but getting a G whistle would let me start an octave lower, yes? I could get . . .

I realize this is a broad Q, but is there any such thing as a "usual" method of progression when acquiring different keyed whistles for Irish trad music?

Thanks for any wisdom.

John

[jim stone]

A usual method of progression (not nec rational but not atypical) is
D to C to Bb to (A or G) to low D to flute.

[Pyroh]

I'm a newbie who only has a high D whistle, and I only play Irish Traditional Music (so far). So, I'm in the early stages of what appears to be (based on this board) an addiction that only gets worse. Fine.

What would be a good next key whistle to get? For example, I could get a C, which would let me play the D dorian and A minor tunes. I could get a G. I can play G on my high D whistle, but getting a G whistle would let me start an octave lower, yes? I could get . . .

I realize this is a broad Q, but is there any such thing as a "usual" method of progression when acquiring different keyed whistles for Irish trad music?

Thanks for any wisdom.

John

Pray tell, wouldn't it be better to use Search function? Wasting e-paper and all that...

[MTGuru]

is there any such thing as a "usual" method of progression when acquiring different keyed whistles for Irish trad music?

I think it depends on your goals.

If you want to play sessions, then a C whistle is yer pick. For those DDor, GDor, Am tunes, etc. as you say. The D/C combo is a standard session pair. After that, an E whistle may be most useful, as an easy "cheat" for A tunes, and the occasional E tune. And a low D whistle obviously gives you a tenor-pitched alternative for doubling with flutes, etc.

For personal playing, it's whatever strikes your fancy. Eb and Bb are obvious choices, because they're available as inexpensive Gens, Dixon Trad (Eb), some others. Eb is bright and nimble, favored by many; Bb is darker. In the mid-pitched instruments F and then A are prime. The other keys not so much.

I'd caution, though, against thinking about whistle pitches in terms of the tune keys - e.g., a G whistle for G tunes, etc. Most ITM tunes fit the D whistle range. So using low whistles (except D) gives you the wrong range, and requires octave folding. Normally you treat a low whistle as a transposing instrument and finger the tunes normally, resulting in a transposed tune for playing solo, or with other instruments or accompanists who can also transpose accordingly.

As for whistle as an assumed stepping stone to flute, or pipes, or ophicleide, or cowbell, that's a different kettle of fish entirely.

In sum, my personal order: D, C, E, low-D, Eb, low-F, Bb, A.

[Byll]

Hmmmm. The usual progression of whistle keys ending in flute? I think not. I do not find the flute to be the end of the whistle evolutionary continuum. If one wishes the sound of a flute, then - by all means - a flute is in order. However, some do not wish that sound... For those who desire the sound of a whistle, there is only one way to accomplish that reality. Concerning value judgments between the two instruments? An oxymoronic quest at best.

Best.
Byll

[MTGuru]

I guess I'd say that the proposition that many flute players start on whistle doesn't entail the proposition that whistle playing leads naturally to playing the flute.

[brewerpaul]

A usual method of progression (not nec rational but not atypical) is
D to C to Bb to (A or G) to low D to flute.

and then onto mandolin, fiddle, tenor banjo, lap harp, hammered dulcimer.... 'tis a slippery slope indeed!

[fancypiper]

Those cheap tin whistles are gateway drugs to the Uilleann pipes and wooden flutes, take it from a victim.

I started out with a high D, then I picked up a C and Bb. The C and D (plays A dorian fine) are good for group playing, but my favorite practice/solo whistle is the Generation Bb tube with the Hoover Blacktop fipple.

I have almost ended (?!) up with whistles in all keys except for Eb (I want a Burke low Eb). WhOA is me

[jim stone]

Come to the Dark Side. It is your Desstiny!

[Tim2723]

Welcome to the fun!

Other than the D/C combo, I think you'll find that most players just accumulate whistles to suit their fancy or to fill a need when playing with others. All the keys and sizes have their charms. Just give in and start collecting them all! After a while you can get a stand that holds them like a miniature rank of organ pipes. It's all part of the fun; there's really no wrong way.

[BigDavy]

Come to the Dark Side. It is your Desstiny!

Hi jim

So are you joining us in the bellows brigade as well

David

[nancymae]

I'm totally confused as to keys..hopefully someone can help me. When someone buys a C whistle for instance....the low sound (all holes covered) is C. So, when playing with other c instruments...you are only playing regular (no sharps/flats) notes. If you were playing a D whistle..you would have to have alternate fingerings to play with a C instrument?????

Another question--if I wanted to play a song written for a D instrument..let's say "Off to California" which starts on the note "D", on a C whistle...would I only cover up two holes and play a D note--and transpose or do I use the same fingerings on my C whistle..and now, instead of Off to Calif in D, now it's in C??????

Do people with different keyed whistles change their fingerings all the time??? You guys must have humongeous brain power...I can't seem to remember..my fingers just go automatically whatever D whistle notes I have learned.

Help me understand!!!!

Thank you!

Nancy

[Feadoggie]

I'm totally confused as to keys..hopefully someone can help me. When someone buys a C whistle for instance....the low sound (all holes covered) is C. So, when playing with other c instruments...you are only playing regular (no sharps/flats) notes. If you were playing a D whistle..you would have to have alternate fingerings to play with a C instrument?????

It's really very simple. Others may try to obfuscate the answer but it is really straightforward. Whistles are simple diatonic instruments. That's highfalutin' words to say that a whistle plays an eight note scale - like do re me fa so la ti do - starting with the bell note, the one you get with all the holes covered. So yes, with a C whistle you have no sharps or flats - but you don't really have to know that. A C whistle will also play easily in the key of F by cross fingering the B natural note (the note just before the bell note in the scale you are playing). So you use a C whistle to play tunes (or along with songs) in the key of C or F major. And you can play in the related minor keys of Am and Dm (they have the same notes). You use the same fingerings on all whistles. Here's your cheat sheet.

C whistles play C major, A minor, F major and D minor
D whistles play D major, B minor, G major and E minor
Eb whistles play Eb major, C minor, Ab major and F minor
E whistles play E major, C#minor, A major and F#minor
F whistles play F major, D minor, Bb major and G minor
G whistles play G major, E minor, C major and A minor
A whistles play A major, F#minor, D major and B minor
Bb whistles play Bb major, G minor, Eb major and C minor
B whistles play B major, G#minor, E major and C#minor

Another question--if I wanted to play a song written for a D instrument..let's say "Off to California" which starts on the note "D", on a C whistle...would I only cover up two holes and play a D note--and transpose or do I use the same fingerings on my C whistle..and now, instead of Off to Calif in D, now it's in C??????

You just play the tune the same way as on the D whistle but it will come out in the key of C (F actually, isn't Off to California usually in G?).

Do people with different keyed whistles change their fingerings all the time?

No, you don't transpose the tune in your head. You just play the tune the way you learned it. Or if the fiddle player calls for "Nancymae's Reel" in E, you just pick up you E whistle (maybe a B whistle) or take a break. It's the reason that you need a lot of whistle to accompany singers, fiddlers and guitarists that like to play in "their" keys. I could go on but I won't, it's really that simple.

Hope that helps.

Feadoggie

I'll add on further thought here. I think your question is central to the existence of these forums. Unless I am mistaken C&F grew out of the same question being answered by the Indisputable in the Tin Whistle Table long ago. Here's what remains http://www.chiffandfipple.com/whistlekeys.html

[MTGuru]

Thus demonstrating MTGuru's Law, that any explanation of transposition and transposing instruments that runs 25 words or more is indistinguishable from the proof of Fermat's last theorem.

Yer a better man than I fer trying, Feadoggie.

[rap4th]

In "Off to California" usually you have a triplet pick-up which starts on a D running up to the beginning note of the tune which is G.

Rob

*Edit* Oops....I just reread your post feadoggie. I believe "Off to California" is in the key of D.