Lark In the Morning

[Wandering_Whistler]

In another thread Chris Laughlin and CDon made some comments about Lark in the Morning that had me puzzled. They just didn't jive with what I knew, so I wanted to go back and those things without hijacking the Sindt thread. I have no affiliation with Lark other than as a sometime customer. I admit, I was a bit shocked at the comments.

Chris calls them "dishonest jerks". I've shopped a fair bit at Lark. Every time I've called, I've gotten good customer service. The person on the phone has been pleasant, and whenever I've asked if a specific whistle was in stock, someone has always gone and made a physical check for me. The "jerks" and "dishonest" bits don't fit in with what I've experienced.

Chris also complains that they sell "junk Pakistani flutes" to "unsuspecting folks". I look at their whistle and flute page at http://www.larkinam.com/MenComNet/Busin ... tleIrFlute
and here are the choices that I see that people might consider for an irish flute:

• George Orniston Flutes (Scotland, since 1978) $1265 to $4425
• David Williams flutes $1450
• De Keyzer flute (Europe) $550
• Ralph Sweet Flute $250-385
• Ralph Sweet Keyed flute $1600
• Casey Burns Flutes $450-2175

and then...

• no-name keyless irish flute $350
• Lark brand flute $225-$350
• no-name keyed irish flute $375

It seems to me like they have lots of 'named' flutes, and only a couple of the cheaper no-name ones are likely to be cheapies. So, the buyer has a choice...they can take their chances with a $350 cheap knock off, or they can spend the $1000+. It doesn't take much buyer sophistication to come to the conclusion that expensive named flutes are bound to be better quality than cheaper no-name flutes, and that it's taking a bit of risk to buy the cheapest flute on the list. In the event the buyer is unsatisfied, Lark has policies on returns and refunds, and it's listed right on their web page.

Looking through their huge catalog (which I always find interesting and entertaining), there are often cheaper alternatives for expensive instruments (such as chanters and bagpipes). I wouldn't expect these to be of the same quality and calibre as the expensive ones. By the same token, I didn't get bent of shape when a lot of my generations were out of tune that I got in bulk offa Ebay for $3-something each. After all, what do you expect when you're buying at the bottom of the barrel?

He mentions one specific instance of someone getting what he considered a crap flute, though he doesn't mention how he came to the conclusion it was from Pakistan. This is unfortunate, but let me ask this: Do you think that the folks at Lark play every instrument that comes into their shop, or that they're qualified to judge the quality of every instrument in their shop? There are literally hundreds of different types of instruments that they carry. Now, I've heard of folks getting bad Megs, Generations, Sweetones, Burkes, and even Copelands from one whistle vendor or another. Do you think Thom at the Whistle shop road-tests every whistle that comes through his shop? I doubt it. And I don't think I've ever heard anyone say something along the lines of "That Song of the Sea sucks! They sold me a Burke that didn't play well!" or "Thom at the Whistle Shop is a dishonest jerk, cause the Meg he sold me was inadequate!". That's because if this kind of things happens, the fault doesn't like with Thom, or the folks at Song of the Sea. The fault usually lies with the manufacturer (unless the instrument in question was mishandled at the store). Is it HMT's fault if the thin weasel they sell me is out tune? Are they somehow even more at fault if I buy a wooden knockoff whistle from India for a couple bucks, and it's not very good?

Maybe it's just me, but Chris' attacking of Lark because someone he liked bought a cheap flute from them that turned out to be not-great seems to be a bit of an overreaction.

Cdon says Lark "charges too much for everything".
Another quick comparison from the same page, for tinwhistles:
I'll be comparing these whistles with whistles from a variety of stores I found online, and if I've owned one, I'll try to rememer how much I paid and where, and I may list what the manufacturer sells it for on their page if I think the comparison helps. TWS = The Whistle Shop, CSC = Celtic Southern Cross, HMT=House of Musical Traditions.

• Howard High D 'handmade' Brass $199 (TWS had these for $55, but I'm not sure if this was the "hand made" version or not. I think not. CSC sellsthe 'normal' Howards for $200US and ask you to call for a price on the 'hand made' version).
• Howard Low D $105 (melody $109, $105 TWS, $135 hobgoblin, 117 Celtic Southern Cross)
• Harper D $125 (Hobgoblin $115)
• Water Weasel D $99 ($70 from Glen, $71 HMT)
• Thin Weasel D $330 ($290 from Glen, $270 HMT)
• Chieftain D non-tunable $95 (melody is about $100 when the have them in stock. Hobgoblin $88. I got mine for $95 at McCabes Guitar Shop in California)
• Kerry Low D $90 ($64 TWS, $75 hobgoblin)
• Generation $8-9 (comparable prices at Melody, $5ish-6ish TWS, $14ish shannaquay)
• Clarke Original $10 ($12.95 at melody music--www.folkharp.com, $9.95 TWS,$12.50-ish at shannaquay, I paid about $12 for mine at Mars music.)
• Shaw Original $23 (HMT $25)
• Sweet Maple $75 ($75 melody, $75 HMT)
• Susato D Kildare $22 ($21.95 at melody, $22.00 TWS, $22.00 Susato)
• Susato Low D Kildare: $60 ($62.50 melody, $60 TWS, $60.00 Susato)
• Sweetone $8 (I paid $7.95 for one at a Denver airport gift shop, $5.80 TWS, $5.58 CSC)
• Meg $4 ($3.00 TWS, $3.90 CSC)
• Walton's Little Black $6 ($5.00 TWS, $5.50 Celtic Southern Cross)
• Oak $11 ($10.95 at melody music, $10.45 at TWS)

It looks to me like Lark seems pretty comparable to other shops. In a few instances, they charge a bit of a premium (the weasels and Kerry Low D). This doesn't seem to be any different than any other store. No store carries products at exactly the same price--they find out where their market will tolerate higher prices, and they raise them. Lark seems no different, and I personally don't see a pattern of overpricing here.

So, maybe I'm missing something that these guys saw...but I just don't see it.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Wandering_Whistler on 2002-11-19 22:17 ]</font>

[MandoPaul]

My dislike of LITM is that they are a straight retail store trying to be a music store. The San Fran store has a bunch of earnest but ignorant employees who don't know much of anything about what they sell.

If you ask a really probing question, they'll call the main store and hopefully you'll get Mickey.

They don't really provide any value-add for their price. They don't do repairs, don't know the instruments well and aren't capable of giving useful advice to novice players.

By contrast, the WhistleShop is mail order but the owner knows his products well and is able to make recommendations to novices.

So, I don't think LITM are a bunch of crooks; they're just someplace I would never send someone who wasn't already very familiar with what they were buying.

I do also dislike their willingness to sell junk wallhangers as instruments but if someone is silly enough to buy without wondering why it costs half of what any comparable instrument costs elsewhere, caveat emptor...

[Teri-K]

On 2002-11-19 20:02, MandoPaul wrote:

If you ask a really probing question, they'll call the main store and hopefully you'll get Mickey.


I do also dislike their willingness to sell junk wallhangers as instruments but if someone is silly enough to buy without wondering why it costs half of what any comparable instrument costs elsewhere, caveat emptor...

From what I've heard, Mickey sold the company a few months ago; don't know anything about the new owner(s).

I have to agree about the quality issue. The Seattle store carries a large percentage of junk. By this I mean cheap imports that are virtually unplayable. They come off more as a novelty store than a music store. They're also in a very high-traffic tourist section of downtown. That's a good choice for business, but not many serious musicians cross the threashold. The store is full of bagpipes, fiddles, concertinas and guitars that are fit for wall hangings. Lots of little doodads to catch the tourists' eye too. The prices are high, but they must have substantial overhead being in Pike's Place Market area. Yes, they do stock some name/quality items, yet don't display them as prominently. But, there are a number of retailers that do the same.

Maybe I'm being unreasonable (or living beneath a differently colored sky) by agreeing with the thinking that the sales person has some responsibility in letting the customer know what it is they've purchased when they know full well that once home, the instrument is worthless. The Seattle staff is friendly, has some basic knowledge and have to call the home office for any real information. If I'm in the neighborhood and absolutely have to have something, I'll go in and spend my money. But, that's a rare situation.

I've used the catalog service a few times and have nothing good to say, so I won't...

It's not that I particularly dislike LTM, I've just used much better. When someone does right by me, I stick with them. When they don't, well...

Teri

[jim stone]

Second Paul about 'the straight retail
store trying to be a music store.'
The manager of the seattle shop really
doesn't seem to care so much about
music. I've seen him in action on
a couple of occasions.
I was looking for a low D
bamboo flute and I talked by phone
to the sales lady--very nice woman--
who said they have low Fs but never
low Ds. I said that the low D is
very popular, in fact, standard
in Celtic music. It was news to her,
but she said the info would help
her make a case to the manager about
ordering one, etc. It helps to
walk in the place and sample the
ambience, too. I got nothing against
this, and I've bought stuff from
them and might again,
but I wouldn't send people
in there who didn't know a fair
amount about what they're looking
for.

[Wandering_Whistler]

On 2002-11-19 20:02, MandoPaul wrote:

My dislike of LITM is that they are a straight retail store trying to be a music store...

This, I can understand.

[CDon]

On 2002-11-19 19:47, Wandering_Whistler wrote:
In another thread Chris Laughlin and CDon made some comments about Lark in the Morning that had me puzzled.

Snipped

So, maybe I'm missing something that these guys saw...but I just don't see it.

As I read your numbers, they are a bit higher that other vendors only for most things, so my first statement should perhaps be restated to reflect this position as opposed to implying that they are _too_ expensive on everything. I can accept that adjustment... The S&H is the clinker for me. My catalog says that there is minimum shipping charge of $10 plus an additional 3% for items not paid by cash or check (i.e. credit card - most companies stopped doing this years ago). I don't like this business model (my opinion). This to me is a clear indication of a company being geared to walk in business vs. mail order... Its a long way from Alabama to California or Washington. All I wanted on one occassion was a book that cost $8.95 I appreciate the cost of doing business, but it will just have to be at someone else's expense. Its not my fault that they are located in the high rent district. So let those that walk in pay the price, walk away with their stuff, and not have to wait on manugacturing or shipping times, and all will be happy. Me too.

And to all a good night.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: CDon on 2002-11-20 01:25 ]</font>

[Dave Parkhurst]

I think what some of us get our panties in a wad about is that LITM will sell you a poorly made instrument as readily as they will a well-made one. My first set of GHB pipes were from them, and they were finally useful, years later, as wonderful kindling. But other dealers seem to be anxious to develop that reputation also. I think many of the musicians here agree with me that I'd rather be able to choose from 3-4 brands and know that you will not go wrong, rather than 10-15 and be participating in a crapshoot unless you're a experienced player. All things said, LITM does have a very, very cool catalogue...lots of wierd stuff.

[Wombat]

It might help put some of the complaints in perspective if I say a few words about 'Celtic Southern Cross' with whom I do business on a regular basis (and keep in contact between orders.) They were one of W_W's points of comparison in the intial post.

CSC is (are?) Beth Sowter and Mike Watts, two highly knowledgeable multi-instrumentalists. It is a mail-order operation that also runs a summer school (with some very impressive imported teachers) and which provides resources to help Australian and New Zealand enthusiasts get the help they want and to stay in touch with eachother—information on Gaelic lessons, instrument makers and repairers, etc.

Mike and Beth are a delight to know and deal with. They are patient with questions, forthcoming with information, willing to order unusual items if it can be done. They have been very friendly right since my first order, so much so that I sometimes have to remind myself that I've never met them in the flesh. I did talk to Mike for hours by phone once. They know their stock and are quite candid about what is what. They are opinionated—as they should be—and you will not always agree but you will always know why you disagree. When I expressed interest in a concertina, Mike sent me on loan an anglo to try just to see if it was the right instrument for me. (Anglos are; his wasn't, but you get the picture I think.) And if you want an Overton made recently by Bernard, then ....

Here's a link. It's worth checking out, even if you never intend to do business. (And no, since you asked, I'm not on a percentage.)

http://www.celt.com.au/

[AaronMalcomb]

Things may be different under new ownership but 8 years ago when I made the mistake of buying a Pakistani bagpipe, Lark was a little underhanded. That bagpipe probably set my playing back for more years than I actually played it.
In the catalog it said that many "well respected Scottish makers" buy Pakistani pipes and put their own stamp on them. That alone would spur most instrument makers to file a defamation lawsuit.
They didn't say that they are not of a comparable craftsmanship to popular makes. They gave no caveats about the product. And on the same page they had bagpipes of considerable quality for hundreds more than what it would cost to buy it from other retailers. So even if they did give a caveat, paying almost a thousand dollars less for something you know little about seems worth the risk. That is just unethical business.
I hope the new owners turn Lark into a decent mail order business.

Cheers,
Aaron

[Goldie]

I hope that the new owner of Lark turns their reputation around. The "Shark from the Lark" was told to me by many people about Mickie and certainly my own dealings with him also reminded me of that phrase. As others mentioned, when I was in the San Francisco branch in 1999 the people working in there did not have a clue about the products they were selling and had to phone up Mickie, they did try to give me a hard sell but as they had no clue what they were talking about I thought it was a joke. They did not know who I was though and even lied about a product to try and convince me to buy it. As I said I hope the new owner listens to people and actually gets round to training the staff so that they actually know what they are selling. I would far rather talk to a sales man who is also a musician and can even demonstrate what they are selling than a hard sales man who just knows how to sell things and does not know quality from cheap crap. I know this is hard as a sales man cannot play all the instruments but surely he must do some research into what he is selling.

Colin

edited for typo



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Goldie on 2002-11-20 06:20 ]</font>

[ChrisLaughlin]

Well, Wandering_Whistler, as you can see, I am certainly not alone in my opinion and experiences about Lark in the Morning.

Simply put, a business is a business and should be expected to mark up the price of a product. However, I believe that businesses have a moral obligation to their customers to not intentionally sell them poor, defective or useless products, especially when advertised as good products.

While the individual sales-people may not know that a "Lark brand" flute is a worthless piece of junk that will ruin someone's embouchure, turn them off from playing the flute and waste $400 of their money, Mickey Zeckley, the guy who was until quite recently the owner of Lark in the Morning, most certainly does - especially considering that he is a well-known collector of fine flutes. The fact that he intentionally profits off the understandable lac of knowledge of newcomers to the Irish flute, selling them a worthless flute without educating them at all about its quality and manufacture (or lack thereof), is shameful.

Imagine a car dealership selling, at lower prices, cars that they were fully aware were defective and dangerous, without disclosing to customers the poor quality of the vehicles and the dangers involved in driving one. It really wouldn't matter what price they sold those cars for - if they advertised them as being good, safe cars made cheaply to lower retail prices, and the buyer discovered shortly after the purchase that they had been intentionally sold a defective, dangerous vehicle, the dealer would most certainly end up in court.

Likewise, imagine if Dell computer advertised a new line of low cost computers, "patterned after" their more expensive models and "comparing to" more expensive models in quality. What if it turned out those computers were actually total junk and Dell was completely aware of it, but had intentionally taken advantage of the trust of their customers in order to make a buck? Dell would most certainly end up in hot water.

Should a buyer have to always expect that they are being ripped off? Should they expect to be cheated? Should they expect to be lied to?

I don't think so.


A seller of any merchandise or service has an obligation to be honest about the quality of what they are selling. Making a profit is one thing, dishonesty in order to capitalize on the trust and good faith of customers is something else altogether.

However, you are more than welcome to buy from dishonest and greedy instrument makers and merchants whenever you like...

Best,
Chris

[ChrisLaughlin]

By the way, "inexpensive" does not always equal "poor quality". If Lark had an interest in selling low-cost, high-quality flutes they could surely sell flutes by Desi Seery, M&E, Dixon or even Olwell bamboos.

Clearly, that is not their intention.

Chris

[Wandering_Whistler]

On 2002-11-20 14:09, ChrisLaughlin wrote:
Well, Wandering_Whistler, as you can see, I am certainly not alone in my opinion and experiences about Lark in the Morning.

I didn't expect you to be, Chris. People have differing opinions and experiences in life. I was merely sharing mine, as my experience with Lark thus far has been counter to the way you described them. I wouldn't expect everyone to come down on the same side of the fence. And they haven't.

Part of the reason I posted was because I <b>haven't</b> had bad experiences with Lark. A few folks got in-tune instruments on time from McHaffie, too, though. I was hoping to spur a discussion to get some more opinions out there, and was glad to see that I did.

While the individual sales-people may not know that a "Lark brand" flute is a worthless piece of junk that will ruin someone's embouchure, turn them off from playing the flute and waste $400 of their money

This is the second time you've mentioned this, Chris. I don't doubt your story about this flute for a minute. But do you know if all the Lark flutes are this way, or even most of them? That's the kind of information that's missing from your posts that make me feel that you are overreacting. If you've only been exposed to one Lark flute, and judged it bad, can you really tell anything about their overall quality? There have been folks whose first exposure to Burkes or Copelands have been bad ones, as well. To then write them off as suck brands would be a mistake. Again, I'm not nay-saying your experience...I'm just asking if you have more than just that one. You haven't been very specific about the flutes defects--other than proclaiming that it'd ruin an embouchure, you've only called it "junk" and had the ability to turn people off of fluting. Was it out of tune? Could it not be played at all?

Imagine a car dealership selling, at lower prices, cars that they were fully aware were defective and dangerous, without disclosing to customers the poor quality of the vehicles and the dangers involved in driving one.

Uhm, ever buy a used car? They're cheaper than new, and generally have defects that aren't always disclosed. At least, that's been my experience. My wife bought a used car when we first started dating that threw a rod 2 weeks after she got it.

Likewise, imagine if Dell computer advertised a new line of low cost computers, "patterned after" their more expensive models and "comparing to" more expensive models in quality.

Wal*Mart currently sells <a href="http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product_ ... ">cheap</a> bare-bones PCs for about $200. From what I've read, the cheap Celeron processors they're using don't have a FPU, causing them to work significantly slower in certain applications where the floating point math must be emulated in the CPU.

Should a buyer have to always expect that they are being ripped off? Should they expect to be cheated? Should they expect to be lied to?

I've never expected to be ripped off or lied to the times I've shopped at Lark. And, I wasn't. But a buyer who expects that everything they buy will be of the best quality is bound to end up disappointed many times.

A seller of any merchandise or service has an obligation to be honest about the quality of what they are selling.

It's been my experience that nearly all sellers of merchandise play up a products strengths and play down a products weaknesses. Those that are more honest than sales-oriented are rare and to be treasured.

However, you are more than welcome to buy from dishonest and greedy instrument makers and merchants whenever you like...

Well, I'm glad I have your permission to shop where I'd like. From what I can tell is that most people seem to see Lark as a "department store" of instruments. They're a big retail shop, and the folks there don't have a passion for instruments, and don't know them well, and not all of them are the greatest quality, and you should only go there if you know what you're looking for in advance. (Shrug) I'm OK with that, actually. I don't think that every music shop owner has to lovingly hand down musical wisdom to every clueless customer who walks into his shop. I still maintain that most folks should realize that the cheapest thing on a price list isn't likely to be good as the other things (especially if that cheap thing is several times cheaper). I would never expect a Yugo to drive like a Dodge Viper...though folks who own Vipers may rightly denigrate the handling and performance of that Yugo, that doesn't mean that there isn't someone who'll be glad to have it.

[ChrisLaughlin]

Wandering Whistler,
I really don't understand why you are so intent on coming to the conclusion that Lark in the Morning is a decent shop.

Their "Shark in the Morning" reputation is very, very well known and has been expressed to me by almost every traditional musician I've ever heard discussing Lark.

It may have occured to you at this point that your experience of good service from Lark is NOT the usual experience. It also may have occured to you that Lark's bad reputation did not just materialise out of nowhere... they've worked hard to earn it.

As for my knowledge of their products.... I spent a total of about 10 hours - no exaggeration - on two seperate occasions, in their store in Seattle trying out every single flute and whistle they had. Out of the entire lot, only two or three of the flutes were at all decent (most of the whistles were cheap Generations and Susatos, etc - and the expensive ones were crappy Chieftans), and those had been sold to them secondhand and were not even that good, clearly flutes that had been sold to Lark because they weren't up to snuff (and Lark was more than happy to take them).

Needless to say, the "Lark" brand flutes were pure crud.

Consider the description of said flutes in their catelog:
"Pratten pattern. Great Flute! Made of quality seasoned woods with ring mounts, patterned from a number of fine original instruments. This flute is pitched in D, with a tuning slide. Compares Irish flutes selling for much more! With case."

Which Pratten are they talking about here? Ralph Pratten? Seymour Pratten? Certainly not Sydney Pratten. These flutes looked very little like any Pratten I've ever seen and played.

"Great flute!" No, these flutes suck.

"Quality seasoned woods..." Um, no again... if the wood is such high quality then why does the "cocus" cost less than the blackwood variety? The fact that many Pakistani flutes are made of a cheap variety of "cocus" reinforces my belief that these are Pakistani flutes.

"Patterned from a number of fine original instruments". Which fine original instruments are they talking about here, flugelhorns? Seriously, they need to find some new "fine original instruments" if they intend to continue making such "great flutes".

"This flute is pitched in D, with a tuning slide." Yup, you can play a D if you adjust the tuning slide properly. However, it won't be a very strong D and all the other notes will be out of tune... however, if the D is all you're really interested in then knock yerself out.

"Compares Irish flutes selling for much more!" Yes, compares extremely poorly. It's a good thing for Lark that they don't have any decent flute players in their store who could compare a high end flute to one of these cheap pieces of junk for a new flute player looking for honest advice on a where to begin.

Yes, Wandering Whistler, I've bought a used car and have been well aware of the risks involved. However, when I buy a new car (if that time ever comes), I will expect that there will not be any undisclosed problems with it. These "Lark" flutes are not used flutes. They are new and advertised to play well. A customer should expect to get the product that is advertised. Buying a new flute should not be like buying a used car from a sleazy salesperson. David Migoya is a great example of someone who sells top notch instruments, is very clear about what he is selling, and is equally clear and honest if the instrument is less than top quality.

As for WalMart's cheap computers... yup, they sell cheap $200 computers. They also let potential buyers know quite clearly exactly what the specs of the system are so they can decide whether the low price is worth it. I don't see anything wrong with that. However, if they advertised them as "Great computers! These systems use the same great components as other, more expensive models and work almost as well", then I think they'd run into more than a little trouble rather quickly.

You see, Lark in the Morning is advertising their product as a good product at a reduced price, when the truth is that it is a pathetically poor product at a price nearly double what similar flutes sell for on e-bay. They are falsely advertising these flutes every step of the way and raising prices as high as possible to milk as much profit out of them as possible.

Of course a buyer who blindly expects top quality in every product they purchase will end up often disappointed, which is exactly why people like myself are so adament about letting buyers know NOT to trust that Lark will sell them a good product. If you look around the internet you'll find that sites that allow customers to rate merchants and products have become very popular and have essentialy made or broken businesses, depending on their product and service. You, it would appear, are the one of the few people who has had a good experience with Lark in the Morning. I'm sincerely glad you didn't get ripped off (or at least think you didn't), but just because you didn't get ripped of does not mean that others haven't, nor does it mean you won't be ripped off next time you shop with them. At this point, your voice, arguing for the quality of Lark in the Morning, is like that one guy reviewing a business on E-pinions, who insists "Elmer's Electronics Rip-Offs is awesome! The rest of you don't know what you're talking about!", despite the fact that there are another 150 reviews of the business saying - "Crummy product. False advertising. High prices. Extortionate shipping. Bad service". It just doesn't make any sense to me that you are so adament about defending these guys.

Anyways, it's clear that you've made your mind up to like Lark in the Morning, to like Chieftan whistles, etc. I really don't have any problem with that whatsoever. They really need customers like you. However, I will continue to lead customers away from merchants and makers who I consider, from good knowledge and experience, to be dishonest and greedy. Why? Because I care about them and I don't want to see anyone ripped off. I don't stand to gain anything from being critical of Lark in the Morning. My only purpose is to help customers like myself who might not know better without the guidance of someone like me. I know I'd certainly be greatful if someone guided me away from bad products and merchants, and I'd be pretty angry if they let me go ahead and get burned, knowing very well that's what would happen. I'd be even more angry if they actually encouraged me to end up getting burned, which is, in light of the overwhelming experience with Lark in the Morning, exactly what you are encouraging people to do.

Chris


Edited for spelling and grammar.


_________________
"Some whistles just plain suck." ~ M. Gandhi


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ChrisLaughlin on 2002-11-20 16:49 ]</font>

[JessieK]

On 2002-11-20 16:37, ChrisLaughlin wrote:
Which Pratten are they talking about here? Ralph Pratten? Seymour Pratten? Certainly not Sydney Pratten. These flutes looked very little like any Pratten I've ever seen and played.

Hee hee!!

I just want to weigh in to say that I, too, spent about 10 hours in the Lark store, though it was the one in San Francisco. For people who are knowledgeable about instruments, the place is like Disneyland. I had a ball! But it's true, 7 out of 10 instruments there were crap. I got to try them all, though, and I came away with some very nice things. Still, I got that benefit because I was there in person. I would NOT buy instruments from them through the mail! Their salespeople, though very nice, knew just about nothing about the instruments, and the days that I was there, I was basically an honorary employee, helping customers with flutes and whistles (the salespeople lent me their keys to the case with the instruments). I had great fun there, and I think it's a wonderful place to visit and try instruments, but the mail order thing is another deal entirely, and if it's not a book or a CD, I wouldn't recommend buying it from them through the mail. Still, I don't hate Lark.

Jessie