Difference between tin whistle and Irish flute?

[farmerjones]

Besides being side blown and the need for an embouchure, what is the difference between a tin whistle (including low whistles) and the Irish flute? Is the flute a chromatic instrument as opposed to the diatonic whistle? Not that I'm thinking about converting anytime soon, just curious.

Thanks!

[Peter Duggan]

Is the flute a chromatic instrument as opposed to the diatonic whistle?

Well, you could argue that they're both chromatic... or not. Or that the whistle's more chromatic than the keyless flute because it produces clearer half-holed notes. But, while some folk seem to think half-holing and forked fingerings (which may work on some smaller-holed flutes) are omnipotent, I'd say that most flutes need keys for all but the most casual accidentals.

On quite another note, flutes respond differently than whistles to breath, articulation, fingering comfort etc. and most players probably make adjustments (conscious or otherwise) when transferring settings from one to the other.

[Sirchronique]

I'm primarily a whistler, but some differences I can tell you:

On a flute it seems there is generally more ability to control volume and tone than there is on a whistle, due to the fact that you can change your embouchure on a flute, whereas the soundblade on a whistle is fixed. By changing the shape of one's mouth when blowing, you can change the tone on a flute by quite a bit, so it does give one more options in that department. You can make the tone nice and hazy, or clear and open sounding, depending on how you blow it.

So, besides the two instruments having a different tone, there are more options for tonal variance with flutes. There are some exceptions, as there are whistles that do offer more in the way of tonal and volume dynamics than other whistles, but a flute allows for more of it. Also, I'll add that flute is much more challenging to learn at first! It takes a good while to be able to learn to get a consistent sound from it.

And as mentioned, either instrument can achieve the semitones by half holing, but flutes offer the option of adding keys for the half steps away from the hole, which is much easier than half-holing, and also some flutes have keys to play C# and C, so it can play a note that is a whole tone lower than the lowest note on a whistle of the same pitch.

The fingering on both is the exact same on whistle and flute, for both octaves. The only difference in fingering is when there's keys involved, but the 6 holes are still the same, and not all irish flutes have keys.

Also, flutes usually have better volume for sessions. They are generally more accepted, too. I know some sessions frown upon low whistles (at least as far as I can conclude from a number of low-whistle hating posts I've read on some websites. Many sessions don't mind, though). Soprano whistles and irish flute have been around for a long time, but low whistles have not been a part of the irish musical tradition until more recent history. Many low whistles would have a hard time being heard in a session, too. Low whistle is usually fine, but not everywhere. On the other hand, I don't think you'll find many people who object to a flute.

Overall, they are two completely different instruments, though. The low whistle has it's charms, too, some of which I think the flute can't replicate exactly, despite the variety they offer.

[Ronnie]

When playing the whistle its like being in the city but once you are there, you realize that there is a whole country that lies behind to be discovered and that's the flute. I must warn you however that if you are planning to discover that country, you will be hooked for life. I tend to pick up the whistle rarily now being the first little instrument I tried. Nowadays I'm not so fond of sitting just close next to a whistle player but that has to do with my hearing, not the whistle. I played wooden whistles but that maybe had already something to do with my preference towards wooden instruments. I find it also interesting that some friends of me gave up on the flute because there is a run-in period to be considered but once the hyper ventilation is gone, there is a whole range of tones, ornamentations etc.. to be found. Also something I found out lately that due to the fact that everbody has his or her limitations and everybody plays according his or her abbilities the flute is different for each person. What I want to say is that some call it style but I'd rather call it having an own voice, sound because of your "skills". They are personal and with a whistle this isn't so much the case. Good luck with the adventure, its a great one !

[Mr.Gumby]

Aren't you a bit biased by your own preference Ronnie? No real quibble about the flute having more colour than the whistle but there are many whistlers with distinctive voices, just as there are very indistinct fluteplayers around. As with any instrument a player works with the instrument's strengths and limitations and tries to achieve the best expression of his/her musical vision. But at the end of it all, what you hear is the man or woman driving the thing.

Some are more suited for the city, some for the country. I have been wandering around the world that is uilleann piping for the past 33 years or so. I find it relaxing and refreshing to concentrate all thought and ideas back into the pure essential patch of ground of the whistle and look at what the core of the matter is.

Ofcourse some would say the fiddle holds the key to the universe but that's for another day.

[Ronnie]

Of course I am biased, who isn't? Aren't you ? I just pointed out something that was posted earlier that a flute has more possibilities in terms of embouchure, playing, Sound effects. a whistle player has a fipple and that's it. In fact you are saying the same as I do or am I mistaken here ? There's professor/teacher fluteplayer in the documentary on Patrick Olwell who demonstrates this in two seconds and couldn't be imitated by any whistle player.
P.S
I would never pretend that a whistle player couldn't have personality in his play. I did it too you know but why do you think I evolved towards the flute? That's the question.

[Mr.Gumby]

[...] a whistle player has a fipple and that's it. [...]
P.S
I would never pretend that a whistle player couldn't have personality in his play. .

It was just a friendly poke Ronnie. However you did say:

What I want to say is that some call it style but I'd rather call it having an own voice, sound because of your "skills". They are personal and with a whistle this isn't so much the case.

and I while I understand what you're getting at, I like to take a broader view of 'having a voice', enjoying different means to an end.

[Ronnie]

I know you were poking Mr Gumby, just poking back lol.
However, I do know I have to stay sharp and focused on this forum, stay awake and pay attention on what I'm writing down lets put it this way; I think these were the words of Jon Cornia or was it Robert Migoya, or who was it again? Dang I'm using real names again the only instrument where I can feel my breath beneath my fingertops or something like that? In danger of being biased again, I think the flute has a timbre which is very particular and very hard to imitate on a whistle. I like the whistles' little voice but I find a flute the real challenge because its a never ending learning process and if you want to maintain a good embouchure (which I can't mind you) you always have to be focused. Having said this, once and a while comes this talented man or women to visit and you think.......what the f..ck is happening?

[highwood]

the only instrument where I can feel my breath beneath my fingertops

the only???

tis probably true of any open hole blown instrument - certainly can be true for a whistle.

[Ronnie]

I give up, too hot to discuss on the Net.
lol

[farmerjones]

I swear I didn't mean to start a holy war here guys! So I take it that there really isn't a whole lot of difference, besides the flute having a bit more complexity. I might get one in the future when I'm a better whistle player.

[Julia Delaney]

...the fiddle holds the key to the universe...

[Ronnie]

I swear I didn't mean to start a holy war here guys! So I take it that there really isn't a whole lot of difference, besides the flute having a bit more complexity.

No worries Farmer, anything goes as long as we stay civil up here. Referring to your quote; I wish that it was that simple . Fiddle is the keyword, much more rewarding in the end....

[whistle1000]

Now that is a loaded question!...I was always under the notion that they were essentially the same thing...one side blown, the other vertically...I've been playing whistles for 25+ years....I know my way around a whistle...I also noodle around with other instruments...I started flute with one of Doug Tipple's and now have a Copley....that was over 2 and 1/2 years ago...I've met some players who made the adjustment in about 6 months or so...All I can say is that they are COMPLETELY different animals!...only the fingering seem to be the same, IMHO...after all that time, I can certainly get some tunes out of the flute but I am in no way a flute player!...someday, I hope to be able to rip away on the flute like I can on whistles but I fear that is a long ways away!...over the years I've run into flute players who've asked how come I don't play the flute....initially it was a neck injury that prevented starting the flute...I now seem to be over the pain...I've always been a little annoyed by the "arrogance" and distain some flute players have for the whistle, esp.. Low D...initially I got the flutes just to see what all the fuss was about...I'm very musical and in my "arrogance" I had in the back of my mind, " I'll show these &*&#@ fluters that they are the same thing"...boy was I WRONG!....for me it will be a lifelong struggle I'm sure....as it seems to be for some fluters I've met who've been playing 30+ years...I now, am painfully aware of the difference between the two!....I've lost the "attitude" towards flute players and now have nothing but the utmost respect for their skills and dedication to the flute...I owe them all a collective apology....that being said, I owe all the fluters here a big, huge thank you for sharing all your collective knowledge...EVERYTHING I've learned about thus far, I " learned" solely from Chiffandfipple....from the flute makers, holding, blowing etc, etc, etc...you guys rock!!...sorry about such a long post to my first flute forum....I know that this topic has been discussed here at length many, many times so I will not take up any more of your time with my lack of knowledge...just use the search engine to find past discussions.....to all you whistle players who want to play flute, good luck...it seems to be a long road but from listening to some of the great flute material, it seems to be a noble journey...edited to add players with 3o+years playing and not 30+ fluters...

[Gordon]

I give up, too hot to discuss on the Net.
lol

No, I got myself in hotter water a few years back, when I suggested the whistle was little more than a child's toy...